Good leftists (people who know history, are empathetic, respect reality, understand the struggle, do organizing, etc.) will likely not go for this.

However there are people of uncertain ideology who adopt some leftist positions who probably will.

It's an odd movie. All the revolutionary stuff seemed fake & preposterous.

And anachronistic. It pasted 1970s Weather Underground & related styles onto the 21st century, where this stuff made no sense.

I mean, really. It's obvious that the voters elected Trump.

So these people go around saying, "no wait, it's the voters' fault", as if it's some grand revelation.

Everybody knows that. The thing is, knowing we have such voters, what do we do to get better results going forward?

How do you plan to do this?

Unions are not the force they once were. Most of our media is in bad hands. The cloud of propaganda & misinformation is denser & more malevolent than ever.

This is silly.

Voters will make bad decisions. We have demonstrated this over & over.

Still we must win.

So what to do? Blaming voters seems pointless to me. They are who they are. We can't change them out & get new ones.

The voters definitely bear a responsibility. Of course.

But Dem candidates/political workers/etc. don't control what voters do.

Dem candidates/political workers/etc. DO control what they do to persuade & motivate voters.

The point is do a good job on what you have control over.

You may never hear that. Still we have to win the elections

Ah, you’re not complaining.

Do you know this person voted for Trump?

I doubt anyone here wanted Trump to win.

We are discussing why Dems lost.

Yes, they have agency, obviously.

It's been shown over & over they don't always use that agency as you or I think would be best.

So then what? We still have to win.

Imo complaining about them is a dead end.

People can blame them if they want.

It doesn't lead to winning elections imo.

There is a way to confront that.

Imo, the Harris campaign did not do enough to beat the GOP caricature of her.

The way to beat it is be like Bernie - have 4-5 policies that address regular people's economic pain, and talk about them all the time - every time a mic is put in your face.

Right, the media environment is a big part of it.

But still, the campaign needs to sell itself to the voters. Esp in today's world, where so many are disconnected, cynical, pissed at both sides, etc.

Seems obvious. (Also can say it's the job of the candidate.)

Dems are at a disadvantage cuz RW media has a bigger reach.

But still, people need to get that voters don't automatically do what you think is best. You need to go get them.

You can blame the voters if you like.

But in the end neither the candidate nor the party controls the voters. They decide as they will.

The job imo is to understand the voters & convincingly offer a program & message that speaks to their needs.

I don't think Harris did that well enough.

I mean, I take your point, but that there potato salad (looks delicious) has parsley, red onion, maybe some other stuff going on.

And, let's face it, potatoes w mayo is a very solid combo.

The choices from where we stand now are 1) multi-ethnic/religious democracy, where all have their rights protected, or 2) Israel continues its extermination campaign.

Both Jews and Palestinians are victims of European antisemitism. This needs to be understood & accepted. Sucks but it's what it is

It's been going on awhile. Several decades at least.

wow that's great - thanks!